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	<title>Comments on: Looking back: Why I think ID is winning, and why it might not look that way yet 2</title>
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	<link>http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelligent-design/looking-back-why-i-think-id-is-winning-and-why-it-might-not-look-that-way-yet-2/</link>
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		<title>By: William J. Murray</title>
		<link>http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelligent-design/looking-back-why-i-think-id-is-winning-and-why-it-might-not-look-that-way-yet-2/comment-page-1/#comment-294268</link>
		<dc:creator>William J. Murray</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Aug 2008 17:00:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.uncommondescent.com/?p=3540#comment-294268</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t understand how one accounts for the chance parameters of any supposed multiverse scenario. Isn&#039;t &quot;chance&quot; actually a statistical product based on commodities found in our universe? How would one make a claim that &quot;chance&quot; even exists in whatever super-natural context is supposed to produce variant sets of &quot;natural&quot; laws?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t understand how one accounts for the chance parameters of any supposed multiverse scenario. Isn&#8217;t &#8220;chance&#8221; actually a statistical product based on commodities found in our universe? How would one make a claim that &#8220;chance&#8221; even exists in whatever super-natural context is supposed to produce variant sets of &#8220;natural&#8221; laws?</p>
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		<title>By: CannuckianYankee</title>
		<link>http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelligent-design/looking-back-why-i-think-id-is-winning-and-why-it-might-not-look-that-way-yet-2/comment-page-1/#comment-294152</link>
		<dc:creator>CannuckianYankee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Aug 2008 20:47:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.uncommondescent.com/?p=3540#comment-294152</guid>
		<description>Clarification: &quot;And as such, this will change the way science is validated as science.&quot;

I should have said that it will change the way science is validated with respect to evolution.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Clarification: &#8220;And as such, this will change the way science is validated as science.&#8221;</p>
<p>I should have said that it will change the way science is validated with respect to evolution.</p>
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		<title>By: CannuckianYankee</title>
		<link>http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelligent-design/looking-back-why-i-think-id-is-winning-and-why-it-might-not-look-that-way-yet-2/comment-page-1/#comment-294151</link>
		<dc:creator>CannuckianYankee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Aug 2008 20:39:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.uncommondescent.com/?p=3540#comment-294151</guid>
		<description>Patrick: &quot;Not quite. If Darwinism “loses” (and seeing how evolutionary theory is partially correct I don’t see it disappearing) there will be some people who accept the multiverse argument as a backup.&quot;

But it appears that the multiverse argument can never have the explanatory power of the Darwinian argument simply because the multiverse does not have any real observational data.  It is merely a guess mandated by materialist assumptions.  If ID shows that those materialist assumptions are invalid, then the multiverse argument falls on its face as well.  There may be some who still cling to it out of philosophical necessity, but not out of empirical necessity.

There&#039;s another discussion similar to this going on in the next blog post, where they are comparing Darwinism with all of the other scientific theories, and the difference lies in the mathematical rigour by which other theories are formulated - not so in Darwinism.

The point being, that if ID wins, it will be because of a rigourous presentation of the facts, not because of an opposing collection of fairy tales.  And as such, this will change the way science is validated as science.  Therefore, unless the multiverse arguments are backed by mathamatical rigour, they too will fail the test of validity as science.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Patrick: &#8220;Not quite. If Darwinism “loses” (and seeing how evolutionary theory is partially correct I don’t see it disappearing) there will be some people who accept the multiverse argument as a backup.&#8221;</p>
<p>But it appears that the multiverse argument can never have the explanatory power of the Darwinian argument simply because the multiverse does not have any real observational data.  It is merely a guess mandated by materialist assumptions.  If ID shows that those materialist assumptions are invalid, then the multiverse argument falls on its face as well.  There may be some who still cling to it out of philosophical necessity, but not out of empirical necessity.</p>
<p>There&#8217;s another discussion similar to this going on in the next blog post, where they are comparing Darwinism with all of the other scientific theories, and the difference lies in the mathematical rigour by which other theories are formulated &#8211; not so in Darwinism.</p>
<p>The point being, that if ID wins, it will be because of a rigourous presentation of the facts, not because of an opposing collection of fairy tales.  And as such, this will change the way science is validated as science.  Therefore, unless the multiverse arguments are backed by mathamatical rigour, they too will fail the test of validity as science.</p>
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		<title>By: CannuckianYankee</title>
		<link>http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelligent-design/looking-back-why-i-think-id-is-winning-and-why-it-might-not-look-that-way-yet-2/comment-page-1/#comment-294141</link>
		<dc:creator>CannuckianYankee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Aug 2008 17:36:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.uncommondescent.com/?p=3540#comment-294141</guid>
		<description>Bililiad: &quot;What the materialists can’t get their head around is that if “Darwinism” loses, ID wins by default…&quot;

Yes, because the materialists have clung to the only scenario that could be true under materialist assumptions: Neo-Darwinism.

It means that methodological naturalism as the driving method behind doing science also loses.

Going wherever the evidence leads transcends all assumptions, materialist and non-materialist.  Flew got it right.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bililiad: &#8220;What the materialists can’t get their head around is that if “Darwinism” loses, ID wins by default…&#8221;</p>
<p>Yes, because the materialists have clung to the only scenario that could be true under materialist assumptions: Neo-Darwinism.</p>
<p>It means that methodological naturalism as the driving method behind doing science also loses.</p>
<p>Going wherever the evidence leads transcends all assumptions, materialist and non-materialist.  Flew got it right.</p>
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		<title>By: CannuckianYankee</title>
		<link>http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelligent-design/looking-back-why-i-think-id-is-winning-and-why-it-might-not-look-that-way-yet-2/comment-page-1/#comment-294140</link>
		<dc:creator>CannuckianYankee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Aug 2008 17:29:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.uncommondescent.com/?p=3540#comment-294140</guid>
		<description>Denyse: &quot;Reuters informs me (surprise, surprise), the man-ape failed a DNA test, so the father (s) of the presumed hoax are the hikers.&quot;

Oh, but wait, the DNA evidence simply shows that in the distant past, human evolution branched off when humans interracted with oppossums, and a new species was born.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Denyse: &#8220;Reuters informs me (surprise, surprise), the man-ape failed a DNA test, so the father (s) of the presumed hoax are the hikers.&#8221;</p>
<p>Oh, but wait, the DNA evidence simply shows that in the distant past, human evolution branched off when humans interracted with oppossums, and a new species was born.</p>
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		<title>By: Patrick</title>
		<link>http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelligent-design/looking-back-why-i-think-id-is-winning-and-why-it-might-not-look-that-way-yet-2/comment-page-1/#comment-294135</link>
		<dc:creator>Patrick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Aug 2008 17:02:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.uncommondescent.com/?p=3540#comment-294135</guid>
		<description>Not quite. If Darwinism &quot;loses&quot; (and seeing how evolutionary theory is partially correct I don&#039;t see it disappearing) there will be some people who accept the multiverse argument as a backup.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not quite. If Darwinism &#8220;loses&#8221; (and seeing how evolutionary theory is partially correct I don&#8217;t see it disappearing) there will be some people who accept the multiverse argument as a backup.</p>
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		<title>By: johnny</title>
		<link>http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelligent-design/looking-back-why-i-think-id-is-winning-and-why-it-might-not-look-that-way-yet-2/comment-page-1/#comment-294134</link>
		<dc:creator>johnny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Aug 2008 16:47:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.uncommondescent.com/?p=3540#comment-294134</guid>
		<description>bililiad wrote,

&quot;What the materialists can’t get their head around is that if “Darwinism” loses, ID wins by default…&quot;

How many here would agree with that statement?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>bililiad wrote,</p>
<p>&#8220;What the materialists can’t get their head around is that if “Darwinism” loses, ID wins by default…&#8221;</p>
<p>How many here would agree with that statement?</p>
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		<title>By: O'Leary</title>
		<link>http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelligent-design/looking-back-why-i-think-id-is-winning-and-why-it-might-not-look-that-way-yet-2/comment-page-1/#comment-294127</link>
		<dc:creator>O'Leary</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Aug 2008 11:36:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.uncommondescent.com/?p=3540#comment-294127</guid>
		<description>For readers not into Bigfeet, the story is that two Georgia hikers found a 7-foot-750 lb &quot;man-ape&quot;.

I can&#039;t make the pictures on the guys&#039; Web site come in (maybe just my system?)

&lt;a href=&quot;http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/posted/archive/2008/08/15/184567.aspx&quot; target=&quot;another&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Here&#039;s&lt;/a&gt; the National Post&#039;s view: Best quote out of this may be: 

“This is becoming like an alien autopsy,” Jeffery Meldrum, a noted Bigfoot researcher and a professor of anthropology at Idaho State University, said. “It’s shenanigans.” 

Reuters &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.canada.com/vancouversun/news/story.html?id=f43e5b22-43ae-473e-987c-66c1cd4b9212&quot; target=&quot;another&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;informs&lt;/a&gt; me (surprise, surprise), the man-ape failed a DNA test, so the father (s) of the presumed hoax are the hikers. Also noted there: &quot;The spread of the online story was fuelled by a photograph of a hairy heap, bearing a close resemblance to a shaggy full-body gorilla costume, stuffed into a container resembling a refrigerator.&quot;

There, that&#039;s what comes of overeating and failing to shave. Evolution at work, folks, you just saw it demonstrated.

When confronting stories like this, I always say, first check the calendar. August is the chronological home of the hot weather story.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For readers not into Bigfeet, the story is that two Georgia hikers found a 7-foot-750 lb &#8220;man-ape&#8221;.</p>
<p>I can&#8217;t make the pictures on the guys&#8217; Web site come in (maybe just my system?)</p>
<p><a href="http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/posted/archive/2008/08/15/184567.aspx" target="another" rel="nofollow">Here&#8217;s</a> the National Post&#8217;s view: Best quote out of this may be: </p>
<p>“This is becoming like an alien autopsy,” Jeffery Meldrum, a noted Bigfoot researcher and a professor of anthropology at Idaho State University, said. “It’s shenanigans.” </p>
<p>Reuters <a href="http://www.canada.com/vancouversun/news/story.html?id=f43e5b22-43ae-473e-987c-66c1cd4b9212" target="another" rel="nofollow">informs</a> me (surprise, surprise), the man-ape failed a DNA test, so the father (s) of the presumed hoax are the hikers. Also noted there: &#8220;The spread of the online story was fuelled by a photograph of a hairy heap, bearing a close resemblance to a shaggy full-body gorilla costume, stuffed into a container resembling a refrigerator.&#8221;</p>
<p>There, that&#8217;s what comes of overeating and failing to shave. Evolution at work, folks, you just saw it demonstrated.</p>
<p>When confronting stories like this, I always say, first check the calendar. August is the chronological home of the hot weather story.</p>
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		<title>By: CannuckianYankee</title>
		<link>http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelligent-design/looking-back-why-i-think-id-is-winning-and-why-it-might-not-look-that-way-yet-2/comment-page-1/#comment-294123</link>
		<dc:creator>CannuckianYankee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Aug 2008 07:45:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.uncommondescent.com/?p=3540#comment-294123</guid>
		<description>Denyse, I can&#039;t believe you missed this one:

http://www.searchingforbigfoot.com

I suspect it&#039;s another hoax that&#039;s gotten more press than most similar &quot;reports?&quot;, but in the very slightest chance that it may be real, what will Darwinists do with it?

&quot;The Darwinians will, of course, continue to get considerable help from the pop science media&quot;

Oh, so that&#039;s what&#039;s going on.  Who woulda thunkit?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Denyse, I can&#8217;t believe you missed this one:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.searchingforbigfoot.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.searchingforbigfoot.com</a></p>
<p>I suspect it&#8217;s another hoax that&#8217;s gotten more press than most similar &#8220;reports?&#8221;, but in the very slightest chance that it may be real, what will Darwinists do with it?</p>
<p>&#8220;The Darwinians will, of course, continue to get considerable help from the pop science media&#8221;</p>
<p>Oh, so that&#8217;s what&#8217;s going on.  Who woulda thunkit?</p>
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		<title>By: GilDodgen</title>
		<link>http://www.uncommondescent.com/intelligent-design/looking-back-why-i-think-id-is-winning-and-why-it-might-not-look-that-way-yet-2/comment-page-1/#comment-294121</link>
		<dc:creator>GilDodgen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Aug 2008 03:39:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.uncommondescent.com/?p=3540#comment-294121</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Shut up, they explained.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

You have a way with words Denyse. This really does encapsulate most Darwinian explanations.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Shut up, they explained.</p></blockquote>
<p>You have a way with words Denyse. This really does encapsulate most Darwinian explanations.</p>
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