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Climate wars revisited: Finally, does evidence matter in science?

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A friend asks us to notice again science writer Matt Ridley’s complaint about the Climate Wars’ Damage to Science, quoting:

The great thing about science is that it’s self-correcting. The good drives out the bad, because experiments get replicated and hypotheses tested — or so I used to think. Now, thanks largely to climate science, I see bad ideas can persist for decades, and surrounded by myrmidons of furious defenders they become intolerant dogmas.

Previous notice here.

To some of us, the biggest problem was the wholesale manipulation of data, as in Climategate and data fudging.

We were used to this with Darwinism, etc., but then some people began doing it with stuff your nephew or your granny should care about.

Hat tip: Pos-Darwinista

Comments
Holy crud, Bill Nye (you know, the Science Guy) did not even tweet about the crucial NOAA report. Too busy plugging a kickstarter campaign to raise money for a documentary about himself. What a joke Science has become. Bill Nye & Neil Tyson, the faces of science in the USA. Very sad. Waaa.ppolish
July 16, 2015
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"The findings of the 2014 State of the Climate report — a peer-reviewed study that examines temperature, precipitation and weather events experienced around the world — were released by the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration today" http://www.ticotimes.net/2015/07/16/greenhouse-gases-that-fuel-global-warming-hit-record-highs-in-2014-report Big Important Global Warming Report issued today. But hardly a peep. Not trending. Nothing like the coverage that "Mini Ice Age" received. Not even close. Credibility issues? Numbers being fudged by NAOO issues? Are people so sick of global warming stories that a mini ice age story was a cool refreshing breeze? The problem is not Science Deniers. The problem is the Science Convincers. They blew it. Bill (We Suck!) Nye might appeal to the angry Atheists. Big deal. Big Fail.ppolish
July 16, 2015
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You're welcome DaveS. I'm especially fond of the "love starry nights" bit myself. Speaking more of bugs, there was a full grown praying mantis perched on a bike here in the shop earlier this week. Me and a customer noticed, but the conversation changed and I forgot about that big bug. It's gone now..,hopefully hunting black widows.ppolish
July 16, 2015
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Thanks for the detailed answer, ppolish.daveS
July 16, 2015
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And DaveS, most people who know me would consider me a "nature nut". Love animals, love plants, love a starry night. The "career placement" test I took back in high school recommended 1) Forest Ranger 2) Florist 3) Pharmacist. I actually happily own a Bicycle Shop. Don't sell EPO though:) Oh, and I don't squish bugs. Bugs in the house/shop are captured and released. May have released a bark beetle or two sorry. Except black widows. Those I do kill, followed by a penance to St Francis of Assisi.ppolish
July 16, 2015
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DaveS, politically I suppose I'm an average Californian. Registered Dem, voted for Hillary in the 2008 primary and Obama in the general election. Have one kid, transgender. Former alter boy turned nonReligious Catholic. Certified Jesus freak;)ppolish
July 16, 2015
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ppolish,
Plants are a critical piece of the ecosystem. Foundational. Plants need liquid water, CO2, and warmth. Imagining AGW being bad for the ecosystem is more scary pseudoscience. No wonder Scientists are becoming as trusted as used car salesmen.
The bark beetles in the western US and Canada would agree with you. ;-) Seriously though, do you consider yourself a political conservative? I'm asking because you seem unconcerned about potentially passing on a lot of problems for future generations to deal with.daveS
July 16, 2015
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Plants are a critical piece of the ecosystem. Foundational. Plants need liquid water, CO2, and warmth. Imagining AGW being bad for the ecosystem is more scary pseudoscience. No wonder Scientists are becoming as trusted as used car salesmen. AGC, on the other hand, would be deadly for ecosystems. If humans were sucking enough CO2 out of the atmosphere to cause global cooling - THAT would be scary. Boo.ppolish
July 16, 2015
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That "future" picture of SF coastline looks like it was before landfill. Landfill Projects can easily outpace sea rise. http://gizmodo.com/5-parts-of-nyc-built-on-garbage-and-waste-1682267605ppolish
July 16, 2015
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ppolish: Projecting modern buildings 100-200 years into the future is hilarious scare tactic. Hilarious pseudoscience. It's presumably meant to show people where the waterline will be. Yes, people will move away from the coastlines. This will create social disruption, loss of arable lands and infrastructure built along coasts, as well as destruction of natural habitats. ppolish: And coastal damage will continue. You brought up temperatures from the age of dinosaurs. A rapid change to that sort of environment would result in severe disruption of human society, as well as a permanent loss of many ecosystems.Zachriel
July 16, 2015
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Projecting modern buildings 100-200 years into the future is hilarious scare tactic. Hilarious pseudoscience. http://news.yahoo.com/10-images-show-coastal-cities-look-sea-levels-220447008.html Average age of a sports stadium is like 30 years. That flooded stadium pictured will be torn down and rebuilt and torn down and rebuilt long before the imagined water rise. Why is this pseudoscience published? An accurate scientific depiction of a coastal city in 200 years will show buildings right up to the coast. Just like today. Ok, maybe some flying cars and robots, but basically just like today.ppolish
July 16, 2015
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Sea levels have been slowly very slowly creeping up for a hundred years. Zachary, it is inherently risky living on a coastline. Enormous coastal damage has occurred over the last hundred years as sea levels have increased And coastal damage will continue. But enormous coastal damage would occur even if sea levels dropped. Coasts are coasts. Risky place to live unfortunately.ppolish
July 16, 2015
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ppolish: The giant plants of the Dino Era thrived on much higher CO2. It was warmer back then too. Hot = Alive, Cold = Dead. And much higher sea levels. Human can certainly adapt, but the costs would be enormous.Zachriel
July 16, 2015
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I might add; you have not lived yet unless you've had Boerewors! https://blondevoyager.files.wordpress.com/2015/02/boerewors.jpgAndre
July 16, 2015
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In South Africa cooking meat on an open fire is called a braai.... It is South Africa's national pastime and we even have an official braai day that coincides with Heritage day. http://braai.com/national-braai-day-mission/Andre
July 16, 2015
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Red meat. Over mesquite. Smothered in garlic butter. I can agree with that! and potatoes.Mung
July 15, 2015
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Redfish. Over mesquite. Smothered in garlic butter. :)Upright BiPed
July 15, 2015
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Eat Moar Meat. Preferably barbequed over a fire based on fossil fuel.Mung
July 15, 2015
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I'm with you, Q. The giant plants of the Dino Era thrived on much higher CO2. It was warmer back then too. Hot = Alive, Cold = Dead. Nowhere near enough dead Dinos to induce a fossil fuel "Runaway Greenhouse Effect". 30,000 parts per million is undoable. Go Warm. Plants are cool.ppolish
July 15, 2015
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Apparently in experiments, plants thrive when the level of CO2 is artificially increased. Presumably plants evolved this way and this demonstrates that the earth is temporarily low on CO2. But we're working to correct this, and I hope to get a new bumper sticker that reads: Celebrate Global Warming! :-) -QQuerius
July 15, 2015
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Are cows a major cause of global warming? Yep. Methane nastier than CO2. http://timeforchange.org/are-cows-cause-of-global-warming-meat-methane-CO2 Eating mammals is questionable. But is it better to live and be eaten than never live?ppolish
July 15, 2015
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100 miles up it is cold. Very very killer cold. Unless the Sun shines on it. Then it is very very hot: "A piece of bare metal in space, under constant sunlight can get as hot as two-hundred-sixty (260) degrees Celsius. This is dangerous to astronauts who have to work outside the station" http://www.universetoday.com/77070/how-cold-is-space/ "If they need to handle bare metal, they wrap it in special coatings or blankets to protect themselves. And yet, in the shade, an object will cool down to below -100 degrees Celsius"ppolish
July 15, 2015
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Twenty years from now as we shiver in the midst of the Zharkova Minimum, this warning from D, Trump will be a "should have listen to the guy" moment "It's freezing and snowing in New York – we need global warming". But last year he took it one step further. "This very expensive GLOBAL WARMING b******* has got to stop. Our planet is freezing, record low temps, and our GW scientists are stuck in ice," he said, referring to a team of researchers who had got trapped in Antarctica."ppolish
July 15, 2015
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Zachriel So you're confirming that my estimate that you are an idiot does not really need measurement the estimate is true enough? Riiiiiiight got you.....Andre
July 15, 2015
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Andre: If I estimate ... will a measurement confirm it? Measurements can refine estimates. Measure twice, cut once. Or quantitatively, the measurement precision increases in proportion to the square root of the number of measurements. asauber: We’ll just have to disagree on that. "The dispersion of the measured values would relate to how well the measurement is performed. Their average would provide an estimate of the true value of the quantity that generally would be more reliable than an individual measured value." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Measurement_uncertaintyZachriel
July 15, 2015
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"Abdussamatov's work, however, has not been well received" http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2007/02/070228-mars-warming.html Of course it was not well received. Saying global warming is not caused by humans is as taboo as saying humans did not evolve from monkeys. He would have been better off saying global warming is caused by monkeys, Science bullies would have let that slide lol.ppolish
July 15, 2015
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"That’s what the paper is about." OK. So does the paper demonstrate that the instruments are calibrated correctly? "It’s not a word game" We'll just have to disagree on that. Andrewasauber
July 15, 2015
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Zachriel If I estimate that you are an idiot will a measurement confirm it?Andre
July 15, 2015
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asauber: Given that, are they calibrated correctly? That's what the paper is about. asauber: It’s a type of estimate for word game purposes only, where you get to define your terms. It's not a word game, but a known feature of measurement. If we make multiple measurements, we can improve our precision. If we use independent methodologies, we can improve our accuracy.Zachriel
July 15, 2015
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"That’s what they used to measure the Antarctic ice mass, calibrated instruments" OK. Given that, are they calibrated correctly? "you still haven’t explained how a measurement, being limited in accuracy and precision, is not a type of estimate." I did explain it. It's a type of estimate for word game purposes only, where you get to define your terms. Andrewasauber
July 15, 2015
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